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Report:Steven Greer Interview with Sterling Allan, 12-3-07

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One of the most knowledgeable and best people to coordinate the funding, promotion and release of zero-point energy, Dr. Steven Greer, Founder of Directory:Advanced Energy Research Organization, LLC (AERO), discusses free energy suppression and his personal effort to bring forth the technology, including his plan to spearhead the massive public disclosure of a key technology, to help ignite the new clean energy revolution poised to begin


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Directory:Organizations > Directory:Advanced Energy Research Organization, LLC (AERO) is a new research and development group formed to develop and strategically protect new energy and propulsion technologies. It is our goal, utilizing a unique strategic approach, to bring forth these new environmentally sound technologies to replace virtually all fossil fuel, internal combustion and ionizing nuclear technologies within 20-30 years.

Interview Transcript

We thank Matt Imber (YouTube user mattimber) for transcribing this interview and posting it at YouTube.

An audio file of this interview is available for download (13 mb mp3).

Part 1 of 6


Image:FreeEnergyNowRadioIcon95x95 byKevn.gif

(10:08 minutes)

Steven Greer 12/3/07 PES Interview (1 of 6) (YouTube Jan. 5, 2008)

Opening Narrators: Free Energy Now! Imagine a world in which each home has its own power generator that obtains its energy in such a way that no fuel has to be added. Imagine every vehicle being able to run without ever stopping for fuel. Imagine each appliance having its own power source that never has to be recharged. That is the world of the future. Join with us now, as we tract our progress toward such a world.

Sterling Allan: Welcome to Free Energy Now. I’m your host, Sterling Allan. You can join us online at to see our past shows and archives as well as what we have coming down the pike. Today is December 3, 2007. Our guest today is Dr. Steven Greer. He is the Founder of the Disclosure Project, which is a leading expert on UFO suppression and associated advanced clean energy technology sequestration, and the organization he founded recently is called Directory:Advanced Energy Research Organization, LLC (AERO). It stands for “Advanced Energy Research Organization" was established to protect, and launch a revolutionary energy technology that meets the screening criteria of self-running with at least 1KW of usable electricity. We’re delighted and honored to have you with us today, thanks for joining us, Steve.

Steven Greer: You’re welcome, glad to be with you.

Sterling Allan: Well, we have quite a list of things we wanted to get through today, you know, talking about energy suppression, UFO technology… Ironically, today I was listening to a video tape by John Searle – some pretty amazing technology. Give us an overview of the UFO suppression on one hand, and the associated advanced clean energy technologies that go along with that – kind of a ballpark idea…

Steven Greer: Well, what people have to understand are two sides of the same coin. We don’t actually use the word: “UFO", because that word was coined after the classified projects study in the matter had already identified them as two categories: One are the extraterrestrial vehicles, or ETVs as they’re called at the NSA, and the second are what are what are called the alien reproduction vehicles, which are made by Lockheed Martin & Northrop and a consortium of companies that have been studying the advanced physics behind high electromagnetic frequency alterations in, if you will, spin, mass effect and so-called “antigravity". So the ARVs in the early days were called “Flux Liners" and these were prototypes being built in the ‘40s and ‘50s, and by the late ‘50s, they were fully operational. The early ones, I know of classified programs, and men that worked in them – had a, basically a 24V marine battery as their power-up system, then they went over-unity, meaning that they were acquiring energy from the quantum vacuum flux field, and they would go. And that was all the energy payload that they had on them. So this was a technology of over 50 years ago. But it actually goes back much longer than that. As you know, all the way back to the late 1800s, early 1900s, there were advances in energy generation that Tesla & Stubblefield and others had. And then T. Townsend Brown in the ‘20s began studying the electrogravitic, high voltage effects on mass and doing experiments, and by the late ‘40s and early ‘50s, all of his work, and the Biefeld–Brown Effect, as it was called (Dr. Biefield, at Princeton, who worked with Einstein) – that work “went black" as it were – very classified… and I have a Office of Naval Research document that describes their review of the Biefield-Brown Effect, and T. Townsend Brown’s work in 1951. So that by 1954, essentially all of these operations -- and I think Nick Cook of Jane’s Defense Weekly did a very good job of documenting this – pretty much went off the radar scope – of open source material, although up to 1954, there was actually quite a bit in mainstream aerospace journals talking about this so-called “antigravity" research that was being done. So, the reason, of course, for the secrecy is not hard to understand because if you have the knowledge of acquiring energy from the fabric of space-time, meaning not outer space, but the space around us, you can completely obviate the need for oil & gas & coal and nuclear power and centralized utilities. And, this of course is a huge part of the global economic machine, and the power elites have not wanted to transition out of those systems because of obvious geopolitical interests. I think that the secrecy that surrounds these energy systems -- whether it’s a guy in his garage in Idaho or Searle in England or T. Townsend Brown working on this, or Stan Meyer figuring out how to do the correct frequencies to split hydrogen and oxygen off water -- All of these end up getting suppressed for the same reason there’s been extraordinary secrecy around the myth-named UFO issue. And that is – all of it deals with the fact that once it’s disclosed, and known as a legitimate area of scientific inquiry and known by the masses, people will realize that we don’t have to be dependent on fossil fuels and oil to run our civilization. But that, of course, is the crux of the question, and that is: You have a $200 Trillion + asset base, known as the gas, oil & coal, and there’s really only a few hundred corporations and families that own that asset base, and they are inordinately powerful, and have not wanted this information out. Now, what we’re finding, however is that a lot of these elites are waking up to the fact that they’ve overstayed this energy came a little too long. And, I’ve been having meetings with some of these folks who say: “well, you know, we really do need to bring these other things out. But again, no one wants to do it first. It’s the old problem in America, and I think in the modern world, and it’s everyone wants to be first to be second. When you start dealing with something that’s extremely not only controversial, but would have huge impacts on the status quo…

Sterling Allan: I would imagine their discussions about how to break this out in a way that it doesn’t look like they’ve been hiding it all these years, so they don’t get egg on their face for being the bad guy and keeping this technology from us.

Steven Greer: Well, what I have been told, and I’ll be quite blunt about this is that they’re looking for a group like ours or yours, or some group that could come together that brings out at least the generation 1.0 version of this, so that it can crack the door open, because it’s very difficult for Lockheed Skunk Works to open up their little war chest of stuff and not have it be known that there’s this long history that can be proven of them acquiring them, because there’s an obvious inherent scandal in the fact that we are facing global warming, and mid-east oil wars and geopolitical conflicts, and geophysical meltdown -- which is all an artificial result of this enormous mistake that happened in the early part of the 1900s, and was compounded in the mid 1900s (in the 1950’s) with these extraordinary advances in physics and energy generation being deliberately sequestered away from the public, and even ridiculed, and at times, ruthlessly suppressed, up to and including intimidation, and apparently assassination . So we’re now at the point where most of these folks, and I’ve been told about 70 percent or so of the guys who are involved with these issues think that this ought to be brought forward, but there’s still a very vocal and strong third of them that DON’T want this done. My view of it is that be that as it may, we have to provide some leadership about this because it’s unlikely that the centers of elite power are going to do this unilaterally – I just don’t see that that’s the way, big steps like this happen. It usually happens from, sort of out in left field, a group comes in, moves this forward and that’s what AERO is trying to do. And people can go to, to see what we’re proposing to do, and we’re actively looking for scientists who have a robust system that can be evaluated and proven to be a generation system that would meet our criteria, and are prepared to give people a $200,000 up-front fee for that, and guarantee at least $5 million within 2 years for licensing it and getting it out to the public. So, we have very good support on our team. They’re “Angel Funders" as they were, or I might say at this point, but we have the means to do this. The question is: Is the research community out there in the new energy field able to come up with this sort of system? We’re hoping we’ll see big breakthrough here in 2008. My sense is that we probably will.

Part 2 of 6


(9:45 min)

Steven Greer 12/3/07 PES Interview (2 of 6) (YouTube Jan. 5, 2008)

Sterling Allan: One of the things that comes to mind is: I review the different accounts that I come across of different energy technologies that have been suppressed. It’s almost as if, in some cases, the powers-the-be have a detection mechanism, whereby -- you know similar to: you have these goggles that they can wear for night vision. They have satellites up there, and as soon as somebody builds one of these things, a little light beeps up on this little dashboard of theirs, and they say: Ah-Ha! We’ve got a guy over there in Midland Texas who has one of these things, let’s go get him!

Steven Greer: Well, you know what’s interesting is that this is exactly why the over-arching strategy that we use with the Disclosure Project is what we want to use with the energy disclosure effort, and that is: The enemy of all of the scientists and inventors and innovators who’ve dealt with this, is their obscurity. And, when we did the Disclosure Project in 2001, it was the most watched event in the history of the National Press Club. It was eventually seen by hundreds of millions of people around the world. And the people who are sort of in a background support role of what we’re doing, are frankly very powerful and very well connected, including quite a few “A-List" celebrities in the United States and Europe. And what I have said to people is that: You’re not going to be able to do this in an incremental way. The incrementalist view of this is over. And the other point that I would like to make, and you’re absolutely correct in this, Sterling, is that anyone who thinks they’re going to do this, and remain off the radar scope from the interests that want to suppress it, are frankly delusional. I have talked to so many inventors who say: “…well, I’m going to hide it in a rock crusher, or I’m going to hide it in this", and I said: you’re not hiding from anywhere. They don’t really care to bother anyone unless it looks like it’s going to come out and make a difference in the status quo. So, it’s this sort of this catch-22. So, what we’re wanting to do is provide an umbrella and leadership effort so that the physicists and the engineers, and the innovators can do what they do, and we can provide the protection and the disclosure muscle, if I can use that concept, to see that these things are known by a large number of people. Because once you squeeze the toothpaste out of the tube, you can’t put it back in. Normally, what happens is that these technologies remain rather obscure and they are then discovered and are sequestered. And I do believe that there are high, very well developed detection systems that are able to pick up when someone has something like this operating. I, in fact, I’ve been told this is the case and I’m reminded also of what Ben Rich, who was the head of Lockheed Skunk Works, told us before he passed away, he said: “…look, there are NO private conversions anywhere on Earth. “ And I am quoting. And we have multiple witnesses to him saying this. And so, a lot of these inventors who think that they’re going to sort of outfox the secret groups by being quite, or introducing it subtly, or… and these strategies have been tried for a hundred years and they’ve all failed, and they failed because the ability of this very well-funded, and well-organized, and I might say, extremely high-tech group, to identify people is substantial. So, the only way I see this happening is for people who have these sort of technologies to be sure that they are: (Number One) protected by massive discloser of their existence, and I don’t mean within the new energy community, per say, but I mean the entire planet’s population. And you need to be able to put together a system to do that, because ultimately, that’s your greatest protection. And one of the things I remind people of is that we’re now, something like 6 years & a half past when we had this National Press Club event, where we had 110 top secret military & intelligence witnesses come forward – named, rank, serial number, etc., and not a single one of them have been threatened, none of them have even received a phone call asking them to be quiet. We have not had any of that kind of action towards us. And the reason for it is that we have a multi-layered, strategic security system in place that is protective, but also, these’s just too many people who are following what is going on with this, and so, one of the things that has to happen with these technologies is that they need to move from the cradle of their birth, as it were, into prominence – even if they’re not ready to be sold to the masses, the masses of the population need to know about it because that’s your first line of defense, because it’s only in the darkness of obscurity that these kind of shadowy interests are able to operate and get away with it. Because if they -- if you put a big spotlight on what’s going on, they’re sort of like cockroaches that run into the corners of the house when you turn the lights on. They’re just going to not be out there because they do not want to be caught flat footed, in the middle of a suppression activity. But as in inventor, or a technology group that’s small, even of a few dozen people, is doing this sort of off-the-radar scopes, they’re very vulnerable. And, the point I have made to people is whether they cooperate with AERO in doing this, or whether they do it on their own, I really don’t care except I can advise you, anyone listening that has these sort of technologies, that there is no way anywhere on the Earth, in the deepest part of the Amazon – they can go to Siberia – they would not be able to develop these systems and begin to move them forward outside the cradle of, the birth site of the invention, without it being known by this particular group of folks. And, yes they do have systems that detect them literally when they begin to operate, and tap into the quantum vacuum flux field. And, I think this is why it’s important that we work together, and that we work in a way that learns the history of the last hundred years of suppression, and do a really thorough analysis -- a stenography, if you will, of the subculture of new energy innovation and what has happened, and learn from the past, and not recreate the same mistake as we go into the future.

Sterling Allan: One of the counter-arguments that I’ve heard, to what you’re describing here, is that the political climate has changed substantially in the last five-ten years. Global warming has become a major issue, if not number one, it’s WAY up there in people’s minds as to the threats that we face as a civilization, and renewable energies are becoming popular. The industry is going crazy right now with new venture capital money going in some of these more mainstream technologies. And so, the political climate now, compared to a hundred, or even of 20 years ago, is drastically different. There’s almost an indigenous…

Steven Greer: Oh, I agree. I agree with that, 100 percent. In fact, to give you a measure of this, I was meeting on Friday, just 2 days ago, in Washington, with one of the most connected-up members of this elite club. And we were at the University Club in Washington. And this gentleman, who is connected into the who’s-who of the energy sector of the world, told me point blank, that 3 years ago, he would not have sat with me and had this conversation. Now, he wants us to present whatever we can, so that the “freindlies" within this group can get behind it. And so, what I’m saying to people is, things HAVE changed, and this is why we’re able to go forward, and that people who have the knowledge of how to create these systems need to not be so timid, but they need to be wise in being bold. You know, being bold doesn’t mean being reckless, being bold means making wise choices so that you move forward, and you take the people who are aware of what you just said the environmental crisis, the geopolitical crisis, with the oil & energy situation, which by the way is going to haunt us much sooner than the greenhouse gas problem, and the global warming problem. And that is, to be sure that the strategic capabilities are equals to the technology. What we’ve seen in the past is people have great breakthroughs in these technologies, and they just think that if they have $5 million or $100 million, or $200 billion – give you any number, that they can do it. The money is about 10% of the problem, and the device is about 10% of the problem. The problem is having the strategic knowhow to leverage these things into the circles that you’re describing, which are now on OUR side of the argument, which weren’t there 5 years ago, or even 3 years ago, as this gentleman was explaining to me on Friday, in Washington.

Part 3 of 6


(9:06 min)

Steven Greer 12/3/07 PES Interview (3 of 6) (YouTube Jan. 5, 2008)

Steven Greer (continued): So, I’m very optimistic there has been a major sea change within a number of sectors, where people are waking up to the fact that we really do need to get off of the early industrial revolution’s engines – and that is, Fossil Fuel, & Coal & Oil, and come into a true, high-tech new civilization. And, that time to do that is absolutely right now. And, there are people ready to support this. Not just financially, which is important, I mean, it’s not inconsequential that you… obviously, people need funding. But I think strategically, and network support, and institutional support, and that’s what we have identified over the last 15 years, our group has gotten developed excellent ties into those sorts of groups, and have been educating them quietly, behind the scenes, as it were. And I think right now, we have probably the best potential for bringing a new system out that there has existed in the last hundred years, in fact I’m certain of that. And that’s why we’ve formed AERO, and I think things have changed & evolved enough that we can make a serious run at this, and succeed. I’m not going to say: it’s going to be easy, and I’m not going to say there aren’t going to be a lot of challenges, there’s not going to be universal support, but there’s going to be widespread support, even within these elite circles.

Sterling Allan: A couple of news stories I wanted to bring up along these lines, and also just to mention of a question I wanted to ask, after we address these two news stories, and the question is: What’s the difference between AERO and Seize Power, which predated it? But first, the 2 news stories a week & a half ago, we ran a story saying that the Club of Rome, which is notorious for being behind such things as September 11 events and other atrocities in the history of this planet -- that the masterminding, the conspiracies, if you want to use that word, which is what it amounts to – of these power elites, these black ops, who are running the show, and want to stay in power… The Club of Rome is taking leadership now, in aggregating all of the European clean energy technologies into a clean energy grid, so that you have wind & solar and geothermal tied together for a 24/7 sustainable, or always on, always dependable, back-up system type of thing – and they’re spearheading this thing!

Steven Greer: …right…

Sterling Allan: And so, they’re jumping in, and they’re now saying: “We’re the leaders in this!" …and different you see Exxon, and you see Shell, you know, trying to say: “Hey we’re clean…" You see Chevrolet, and these, big companies who have been the bullies in the past, now stepping up to the plate & saying: “we’re the leaders! We’re the ones who are stepping out on this issue". Last week, Friday, there was an event in London that, in which this was the second news story I was mentioning, in which the rich & famous got together. Together, there was about $100 billion in net worth of representatives in this gathering of people. Al Gore was there, and among the things was supposed to be announced was some new clean energy technology that would resolve our energy needs and provide us with clean power. And I’ve been scoping the news to find a report of what was disclosed, and there’s nothing!

Steven Greer: (chucking) Well, you have to understand that this is a process, and what you’re seeing with some of these announcements, is exactly what I was just describing is that are a lot of people who now are onboard doing this. Now, the first level of this is to say yes, we’ll do stuff with the biomass and geo... different types of fuels, and wind and solar and what have you. Now these same entities certainly know that there are these more advanced systems. But they’re laying the groundwork for the idea that we can phase out of fossil fuels. Now, in fact, this is exactly some of what I was talking about with this gentleman - this elite leader in Washington on Friday and that is, the time for incrementalism is over. What you’re going to see is: we’re either going to have our civilization brought to its knees, or we’re going to transition QUICKLY into serious replacements for oil & gas & coal & nuclear power & centralized utility grids, which are all creaky and falling apart all over the world. And, that isn’t going to happen through just solar & wind alone or biomass, or what have you, because it’s inadequate for the needs. You know, we have 650 coal–fired power plants going online in the next decade in China and India alone, which will, by themselves, double global greenhouse gasses – and THAT’S if everyone else stopped using everything, which isn’t going to happen. So, they’re realizing that we have an enormous need for much bolder steps, and in fact, that’s what the crux of the conversation with this gentleman was about. And I have seen this in other circles as well. So, what I think, however, we have to do is not sit back & think that these “elements" are going to do it, that we’re going to have to continue to provide the leadership, because if the people lead, and we continue to do the education, then these other groups are going to come along. And not ALL of them, and some of them may be Trojan horses that are pretending to cooperate, when, in reality, they want to stay in a sort of “metered society. “ You know, J.P. Morgan famously told Tesla, and I’m paraphrasing, but basically he said: “This is great, this sort of technology, but I can’t put a meter on it!" (laughing) … and so, you know, how am I going to make the money?" So, I think that WE have to continue to, while being encouraged by these sorts of things, be also a little skeptical and say that: look, we need to be sure that the new energy efforts that are… the REAL breakthroughs what I think will be the true solutions to the energy and sustainability and environmental issues, which are these sorts of technologies advanced physics, dealing with the so-called zero-point/quantum vacuum field, electrogravitic systems, other closed energy systems, that are not dependent on wind and solar, that could generate a lot power. We’re working right now, we have just issued a $100,000 contract for an engineering firm to build us a 10 KW closed system, that we hope will be done in the next couple of months, to 3 months – we’ll see how successful they are. So, what we’re going to do is continue to move forward, while being hopeful that these sort of large & powerful entities continue to move in this direction, but not sit back on our laurels in thinking that big brother’s actually going to take care of it, because I think that… There’s a saying… When I lived in Israel for 3 years, I got to know a lot of the Bedouin and they have a great expression: “Trust in God, but tie your camel". (Laughs) And, you know you need to do that…

Sterling Allan: Mm-hmm…One of the things that comes to mind as we’re having this conversation is: this whole question of… the prophetic scenario, for a lack of a better terminology, that I had in my mind for many years, is that you have this control paradigm… the conspiracy that is controlling things, it’s running the show, and they have their heyday, and then their time comes to an end. They are appended, and a new remnant comes forward, who are more enlightened, who are more loving, who are more personal responsibility-based, and a new society emerges that is much more enlightened than what has been there before, and there’s kind of meltdown in the middle of the collapse of the status quo as this new thing comes forward. It seems to me that there’s a possibility emerging in which there could be more of a transition rather than a collapse and a phoenix rising out of the ashes scenario… and the phoenix rising out of the ashes would be the new society that’s more noble, more enlightened, while the ashes would be the status quo. What is your take at this time on the transition that we’re looking at? Are we going to transition without a huge meltdown or is a meltdown somewhat necessary to undo the old guys and bring in the new?

Part 4 of 6


(10:08 minutes)

Steven Greer 12/3/07 PES Interview (4 of 6) (YouTube Jan. 5, 2008)

Steven Greer: Well, I think you have both, twin processes going on contemporaneously, and I think that this is how things have always gone forward. And, whether it’s a meltdown, or the, if you will “Old Order" of things, or a transformation is really a matter of free will, in choice. For example, Olivetti typewriters could have chosen to go digital, but they didn’t, so they went bankrupt. So, the carriage makers, that made horse drawn buggies back in the 1800s, could have chosen to go with automotive, but they were skeptical and they didn’t, and most of them went (almost to the coach works?). Not all of them went bankrupt. I think what you have to see is, that this is something that is a matter of vision, leadership, and quite frankly a sort of a spiritual orientation to say: I’m wiling to embrace the future in a positive, hopeful way, rather than clinging on to the status quo. Now, this is why it’s very difficult for governments to do this, because they’re all about maintaining the homeostasis of the status quo, and they’re maintaining their special interest group support, because, at this point, special interest RUN the governments of the world. But, that is changing as well. So I think that you’re going to see a transformation happen, whether or not there has to be some elements of more traumatic collapse is totally dependent on the wisdom of those grasping power or whether they’re willing to let this transition happen. One of the things I try to explain and I’ve certainly explained this in my most recent book: “Hidden Truth, Forbidden Knowledge, “ is that, one of the ways of looking at this is: we can see this as a way that our civilization goes through this metamorphosis, and it can be as painless, or painful as we choose to be. But, that if you are holding onto the old system that HAS to go the way of the dinosaurs, you’re going to be drug down with it. And to the extent that our society is embedded, and, as George W. Bush said: “addicted" to these fossil fuels & systems. To the extent that is we don’t come off that addiction, in a very wise fashion, it COULD be a very difficult withdrawal. And, of course, we’ve had a hundred years to do this. You have to remind people that there’s... it was around 1900 that we really could have phased out of oil & gas & coal, but of course, whether it was the Rockefeller Empire then, or the Saudis & other interests now, it really doesn’t matter. There are very powerful interests that make a lot of money out of keeping people metered to a linear supply chain of fuel. But I think that many of these people… and this is one of the things that I ask people, in their prayers and meditation, and thoughts, is to see those sort of folks seeing a transformation that they can be part of, and they get excited about that. You know, people have to have something to look forward to, and to live for, and you can’t just present this as endless loss for these interests. You can say, look, this has been a good ride (laughing), but now, look at the kind of civilization that we can have on this planet that would have no pollution, the abolition of poverty as we know it, the establishment of true sustainability, and then eventually, with the more advanced versions of these systems the ability to travel among the stars and explore the universe peacefully. I mean, that’s one vision. And then there’s this other vision that’s very etiological & terrifying – of collapse and gloom & doom. But, this is all about the state of the mind of the folks who have to…You know, and I tell people, let’s put out the good vision because that’s ultimately going to prevail. And I think it’s important for us to focus on that, and if we stay with that sort of consciousness, and vision, and action, more importantly, in that direction, it will create its own momentum, and, hopefully pull along the rest of these elements. I mean, some of whom may be recalcitrant, and be dragged down screaming and kicking into this new millennium… But I think for the most part, what you’re seeing is that people are willing to embrace this vision when it’s articulated, and they understand that it’s a win-win situation.

Sterling Allan: I agree with you, and I would like to solidity that. The antithesis of what you’re describing is something that I think is working against the new energy field and that is a paranoia that is out there of: “gee the bad guy’s out to get me…"

Steven Greer: Right…

Sterling Allan: …and the paranoia is… it basically pulverizes it. It stymies progress, that people are so afraid to talk they won’t get on the phone, they won’t send you an email, they won’t talk to you…

Steven Greer: Right…

Sterling Allan: …and the thing doesn’t go anywhere because -- they’re too afraid.

Steven Greer: Yeah, we’re dealing with that with several inventors right now, who are hell-bent on being the tree that fell in the woods that no one heard, because of the past history of suppression, and what I say is: “look, all I can say is that, if you want to be anonymous, we’ll do it with you anonymously. They already know you exist. If you want a lead group that sticks it neck out, to be chopped at or whatever, our group is willing to do that. I’ve been doing it for a long time. I did it for 10 years, running a big trauma center, where people came in with Tech 9s, and you know, we were almost killed several times, in my emergency department, and I’m willing to do it with the Disclosure Project, and I’m willing to do it with this. That’s kind of why I’m on this planet, ‘cause I have this sort of fearlessness about that. But, I think that’s fine. Everyone has a role to play. I can’t hook up my DVD player without having my wife do it, because I’m an electromagnetic moron.

Sterling Allan: (Chucking)

Steven Greer: But, I have other skills. What we all have to do, is come together and figure out what our skill set is. My skill set is being able to build these networks and lead these things forward and put together this strategic protection. That’s what we want to give these inventors. The inventors need to engineer & invent. The big problem is that, there is this defeatist mentality, and I agree with you, where the paranoia becomes defeatism, where they say: Oh, I can’t do anything they’re going to come after me, you know, like a Rottweiler, and I’m just going to sit her and keep this secret, because it’s too risky. But, you know what? I think that thinking is the riskiest of all because if we stay in that sate of fear, we’re going to manifest the outcome of that fear, and that is a terrible collapse for our civilization. So we have to kind of get a new consciousness of… and in a way, it’s sort of a certain courage, and a spiritual selflessness to a point. I was talking to this man very bluntly, Friday at the University Club, in Washington. I said, well you know, the real currency here is the willingness to have the courage of your convictions, and have the selflessness to do something for the world beyond your own selfish ambitions. And I said that if we don’t find people who can do that, our world is in serious trouble, and so… on a certain level, the crisis we’re in – is a very existential crisis… is, at its root, I believe spiritual. And the solution is going to come from within ourselves and I think the means for creating this civilization and bringing these scientists out are all there. And now, we need to kind of figure out how to get out of our own way (laughing) and do it! And when we do, I think we’re going to be surprised how quickly the door is opened for us.

Sterling Allan: One of the things that I think we ought to talk about for a minute is, the new energy that is coming forward, is kind of the opposite of the existing paradigm of a grid this all-powerful grid that’s very vulnerable actually – you know, one terrorist’s bullet can take down the entire western United States for months.

Steven Greer: …right…

Sterling Allan: Somebody from Homeland Security told me that. He was on task to help prevent such a thing from happening. The new energy is such that each home can have, in its garage, a device that powers the entire house. Each car has its own power device, you don’t have to stop & get fuel. There may be some maintenance and what-not, and maybe fuel it up once a month or whatever, with some kind of maintenance thing to keep these going, but it’s harvesting energy from the quantum, or however you want to describe that. And so, that is a very decentralizing paradigm. And so the leadership in the status quo right now, who stand to lose their control… that’s why I think it’s interesting that this “Club of Rome" is looking to aggregate all of the renewable energy in Europe into a large grid.

Steven Greer: …right…

Sterling Allan: …because that’s what they know and that’s how they operate.

Steven Greer: …Right, and what they don’t understand is that, the more you centralize power, the more vulnerable it is in this day & age, and that, ironically, real power comes from letting go and letting it become decentralized. So, the real emanation of power – literally and figuratively, is coming from the individual, and at the village level. And THAT is true sustainability. This old model of vast aggregates of wealth & power that are very centralized is a creaking mess that’s headed for the scrap head of history. And, in fact, I was speaking… there’s a group that deals with global risk management, and one of their big things that they’re focusing on is based out of Switzerland, and it’s a lot of the global elites involved with this, is that they’re concerned about the vulnerability of not just the U.S., but the entire world’s existing power grid of being extremely vulnerable to electromagnetic storms from space, or a terrorist attack, or just plain old falling apart. And I said yes, but you see, these technologies – where you would have your home or your car running on a power plant extracting energy from the space around it – or even, let’s just take some of the work that Stan Meyer had done… If you can develop a system that is over-unity that hydrolyzes, electrolyzes hydrogen & oxygen from water on an over-unity closed loop basis… Every home in America generates 400 gallons of wastewater a day. And most of that is not sewage, most of it’s grey water, which could be charcoal filtered, and you can run your house & car on it.

Part 5 of 6


(9:44 minutes)

Steven Greer 12/3/07 PES Interview (5 of 6) (YouTube Jan. 5, 2008)

Steven Greer (cont.): So, and you know, people complain about the water and say, “well, there’s a shortage of water…" I say, there’s no shortage of water, the Earth is two-thirds covered with water. If the energy is “over-unity" so you can desalinate it, and have it, and pump it, and place it wherever you want to. So, these technologies, whether it’s the quantum vacuum, or whether it’s these sort of advanced harmonic, multiple aphasic systems that electrolyze water into Brown’s Gas, and can be a closed-loop system – we know these have existed, we’re actively looking for someone who actually can demonstrate this for us… These systems would – any ONE of them -- would be able to transition us out of this perilous centralized situation. And. I think that one of the things we have to do is educate these elites, and this is frankly, I spend a fair amount of time doing this -- is that the whole mindset of centralized power & centralized both physical but also metaphorical power, is an old paradigm and we need to let go of that. And it’s hard, because a lot of people get very addicted not to the money part of this whole game, but the kind of power they have, and they kind of get off on that. And I think it’s a psychological illness, frankly – and I think that it’s something that we have to be very careful of. This is why we’re in the process right now of forming a foundation, a non-profit foundation that most of AERO’s assets and funds would be in once this gets going, so that no individual is sitting with a lot of resources that would go into this foundation that will be committed to gifting these systems to poor areas in the world, where, let’s say the system costs 5-to-10 thousand dollars. Well, if it’s a poor village in Asia or Africa, you might as well say $5 billion – they don’t have it, so you’re going to need to bring these systems out in a way that’s cooperative with other agencies & foundations, so that the part of the world that’s actually having an enormous amount of environmental destruction & poverty, that could not afford to buy these systems, would have them gifted to them , or somehow placed in them in a way that would be supported institutionally. So, we have to look at this almost as a global environmental & energy Marshall Plan, is how I describe it. And I think it has to have that kind of thinking behind it, and we need to explain this in a way that the people who are in these elite circles understand that THAT’S exciting – the vision of doing that is as exciting as amassing enormous amounts of centralized power for themselves.

Sterling Allan: Yeah, though, I think you’re talking from your paradigm when you say exciting, because it’s hard to imagine the mindset behind somebody who would help plan 9/11, and be hiding in the shadows to help pull that off. It wasn’t just the hijackers from Arabia that were involved. There were people on the inside who allowed that, and enabled that to happen, and there’s a mentality out there that we don’t comprehend. And, what’s exciting to you and I -- seeing the end of poverty & seeing the empowerment of every individual, is Not what motivates them.

Steven Greer: Ha-ha! Well, you’re right, but you know, I’m reminded of when I brought Tom Bearden and a group of these scientists up to brief the Senate Environment Committee back in the year 2000, in October, 2000, and I was doing an interview with Dr. Bearden, and he said: “Friends, don’t get me wrong, the fools may blow it yet, but we’ve still gotta do this!" And so, my view is this, that yes, there may be a recalcitrant or hard-core 10, 20, 30% of these folks who, for whatever reason are hell bent on this sort of meltdown scenario. But, you know what? They’re not going to prevail in the long run, and I think that… all you can do is articulate a better way… We have a whole group of people who do nothing but frankly meditate & pray for these people’s enlightenment & guidance, and then take the right actions, and teach by your own actions, and ultimately, it’s going to be what it is. But I think that there are enough good people on the Earth -- that the… let’s say, “our better selves, or higher selves" will prevail. It isn’t going to be easy. I’m not trying at all to be Pollyanna, I’ve dealt with some very horrible things in my life, quite frankly. So, I’m not one of these kind of pie-in-the-sky Pollyanna guys, but I do think that we’re seeing a big turning -- even within these elite circles -- towards acknowledging the problem, and being supportive of a solution. Now, I think some of the solutions that you see in the press that they’re supportive of – you were talking about the $100 billion in venture capital going into clean tech energy stuff…it’s all tinkering around the edges. It’s too little, too late. What we need to do is come into the middle of THAT dynamic, and present a technology that is a definitive solution. Now, interestingly, some people would say: “well, those solutions are too good because they DO threaten the status quo". And yet, at the same time, I think that we have to say: “yeah, well it’s too bad". This is 2008, almost, not 1948 or 1908, and we really don’t have time to talk about another hundred years to transition into technologies that I think, through the minds of men, these scientists have been trying to emerge since the late 1800s & early 1900s, that we sort of have had this 100 year run of, if you will, a probation. (Laughs), and we’ve sort of run out the clock, and we have to now realize that we’ll have to come forward with some bold initiatives, and I think people will get behind that. You know, I was encouraged I was recently in Los Angeles and meeting with some folks who were very well known celebrities – A-List celebrities, who, as soon as we can present something that works and has been tested by independent laboratories, and is reproducible, which is part of what we require, it HAS to be scientifically reproducible -- that they’ll get behind it. And, I think that we’re going to see all walks of life, whether it’s elements of this elite power structure, people in the public sector, people in the political realm that are open to these discussions that we’ve had meetings with… I was meeting with a Presidential candidate not long ago, talking about these things, and they’re very excited about this being possible. A ranking member of the House Energy Commerce Committee said: “Gosh, as soon as you have something like this, I would absolutely host you & your team to demonstrate this to our committee in the House of Representatives in the United States". I mean, I think we have a substantial network of people that are “the friendlies", and I think that what the energy researchers out there need to hear is that, they’re not alone, and that there IS a big network they can plug in to, and that we need to make this effort together to see if we can’t make some bold initiatives here in the coming months.

Sterling Allan: One of the thing s that we’ve not addressed yet is… the inventor who comes forward with the technologies that meet the criteria you’re describing – the total pot is $5 million, minimum, and then there’s a $200,000 upfront…Is this technology going to be open sourced, or is it not necessarily one of the criteria of… you know, here’s what you must agree to do if you’re going to tap into our resources? …or,…

Steven Greer: No, this is all individually looked at, and what the objectives of the team are, and the individual. We’re just saying that we have the resources now to provide that level of support for someone who’s got something that’s legitimate, that’s not snake oil, that can be reproduced and proven. And, let’s back this up Open source is great, except one thing: it has to be massively disclosed, it doesn’t preclude it from being protected -- if that’s the root that they would want to go. Open source is not a panacea either, because I can put the designs for a toaster on the internet, and there’s not one out a million Americans that wouldn’t know how to go down to Radio Shack and buy the elements and build that toaster. You’re still going to have to somehow figure out how to capitalize, and I hate to use that word, but we live in the world we live in, so we have to DEAL with the world we live in -- capitalize the building up of the infrastructure to, not only disclose… and remember, when Kellogg’s comes out with a new brand of corn flakes, they spend $60-80 million on prints & advertising to tell the public they have it. You can not bring these systems out, where you’re competing with the $200 Trillion asset base and the status quo, without attracting some serious support so that it can go to the next phase of beta testing, and engineer it into a beta tested model, and also, build the infrastructure for distribution and manufacturing. That’s going to be a capital-intensive process. It’s not like Google or Yahoo or something where it’s software basically, and internet servers.

Part 6 of 6


(10:08 minutes)

Steven Greer 12/3/07 PES Interview (6 of 6) (YouTube Jan. 5, 2008)

Steven Greer (cont.): This is something that’s a real industry that will have to be built up, and I think that the question is: How do you do that? There are many ways to do it. But, you have to be practical in how this is going to go forward. Open source is a very good way of letting people know there’s a basic proof of doing this, but ultimately, someone’s going to have to find a way of putting together the friendly elements who have the resources to begin to build the systems and build the distribution and manufacturing capability, so that John Q. Public can buy one of these, even if it’s a Generation 1.0 version of it, and begin to run their home on it, and begin to transition out of fossil fuels. I think that one of the things that we’re also looking for, is to avoid the big mega & gigawatt systems, because those get into all the regulatory agencies that are mobbed up. And, that if you stick with the smaller units, where it can be in individual’s home or business, or for that matter, cars as a transitional technology for automobiles -- that you can get it out to the masses that way, and have it adopted. So, we don’t reject the idea of open sourcing, we just say that it has to include the ability to take it from something that’s a media splash to something where you can actually have the capital & the resources to build it, because some engineers think: oh, if I just have the design for this on the internet, I could go down to the machine shop and build it for myself. I would say, out of the 300 million people in America, I doubt there are more than a few hundred who would actually do that (chuckling) and take the time to do it. And, not only that, but it’s not cost-effective. So, when you’re dealing with the world with 6 billion people, and you have 2.5 billion people in China and India rapidly industrializing using coal and the WORST elements of the old, creaking dawn of the industrial revolution, that they’re just now entering into, we’re going to have to have some thinking that accounts for that, and practically involves that, and that’s why we’ve brought onboard with AERO some really excellent business people & manufacturing people, who are really angels. They are totally heart & soul into what they’re doing and stand ready to help us move these things forward quickly, once we find something worth doing that with.

Sterling Allan: One of the approaches that I have seen, and it really makes sense, along the lines of open sourcing – the inventor Shawn Frayne, from MIT came up with what’s called the Wind Belt. You take a little ribbon, and the wind vibrates it back & forth & you put a magnet on the end of it, it goes back & forth between the coils & generates electricity. It’s just a small amount, it’s for, like Haiti or some of these third world countries & he’s looking at 2-5 dollars for a generator that would power your radio, or turn on a light at night, and he has a hybrid approach in terms of open sourcing – he says that there’s no way you’re going to want to patent in Haiti, you’re just not going to get your money out of it.

Steven Greer: …Right…

Sterling Allan: So, what you do is, you patent in the developed world and then all of the rest of the world is open source. You put out a plan about how to build one of those things from scratch from off-the-shelf materials, and then the rest of the world has to license it. So you kind of…

Steven Greer: …and that’s a very good idea, actually, and one that we’d be open to. And even then, ultimately, if you’re wanting to have a generator that will do enough of the work so they’re not slashing down the rain forests to make charcoal to cook their meals, you’re probably going to have to have a system where you actually have the whole system delivered there, and… it’s sort of like when they started building wells all throughout India, and helping people so that they had fresh water – you’re going to have to do the same thing throughout so much of the world. So many people forget in America & Europe that half the world lives on less the 2 dollars a day. I mean, there’s enormous poverty out there, and yet, those areas are also where there’s some of the worst environmental degradation occurring, whether it’s the Amazon Rain Forest or throughout Asia… I mean China is an environmental holocaust, I mean absolutely beyond the pale at this point.

Sterling Allan: We have just about a minute before we need to wrap up here… we’ve not gotten to the question that I wanted to address in this segment, and that is the relationship between The Disclosure Project and the SEAS Power and AERO. Maybe you can help us orient ourselves in terms of how these organizations that you founded tie together & work together.

Steven Greer: Well the Disclosure Project is a 501-C3, non profit that gets information and top secret military witness testimony out to the public, and it’s informational, and again it’s a non profit. The SEAS (Space Energy Access Systems, Inc.) was the predecessor to AERO, and SEAS was closed down because we basically had a few hundred thousand dollars just to go & investigate & see what was out there, but no enough to really begin to support building systems. That wasn’t the mandate of Seize, actually. And when we discovered that we weren’t going to find anything that was at the stage that was ready to go from just identification to disclosure, we basically closed Seize, so it doesn’t exist now. And AERO -- we have stood up as an operation, and we have, in terms of Angel Funding, we have about 1 & two thirds million dollars now, just from as I mentioned, Angel Funders who are willing to support what we’re doing so that we can provide the funding as we have recently in this contract to this very good engineering group, and again, provide this upfront 200,000 dollar licensing fee and award to promising technologies, and continue to do this. We don’t, by the way have any paid staff in any of these organizations – not myself and not anyone else. I always tell people who want to work with me is that, at this stage I’ll pay you 10 times what I make, which is 10 times zero, which still zero! But, (laughing) we have wonderful people who are putting up the resources so that we can do this other work. And, so that’s kind of how those projects have evolved. Really, the Disclosure Project, which began in… first it was Project Starlight in 1992 & 3, when I was briefing the Clintons, and the Rockefeller folks on this whole ET & UFO issue, discovered so many witnesses, and so much of our testimony began to track into the high tech energy area, that then it was a natural outgrowth that Seize would then look for these systems, and studied them, and AERO now is at the stage now where we have enough to, at least begin to stand up the efforts to financially really support people who have actually gotten to a certain milestone, and that is, they’re putting out a kilowatt of power, it can be reproduced, it’s not snake oil, the system can have closed loop arrangement, or what have you, etc. and so on. And, actually, the criteria for that is at:

Sterling Allan: Well , thank you Steve, for joining us, it’s been a great conversation and we wish you the best in your endeavors.

Steven Greer: Thank you, I appreciate your help.

(Closing/transitional music)

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